The Hobbyist #7: An Interview with 3sixteen Co-Owner Andrew Chen

The man behind one of NYC's best brands discusses how he built the company and life as a runner

Photo by Chris Fenimore; graphic design by Thomas Euyang

One of the main reasons for starting The Hobbyist was to speak with people like Andrew Chen. Not only is he the co-owner of one of the best menswear brands in the game, 3sixteen, but he is, in my humble opinion, a tier 1 hobbyist. An excuse to chat with him? Hell yeah.

He began the brand back in the early 2000s when he had a full time job—his first career after graduating from college in Chicago. The work was not particularly stimulating, so he began pressing t-shirts and brought the mock-ups to one of the few reputable streetwear shops in the city. They liked his work, so they bought some. From there, he kept on building the brand, hustling in his free time to help move the company forward, building it to what it is today.

Of course, the time between that first run of shirts to now—having storefronts in SoHo in NYC and at The Row in DTLA—involved a lot of grueling steps. It’s a timeline worth examining for any aspiring entrepreneurs. Turning 3sixteen from an after work hobby into his work consisted of treating the company as a second full time job, even when he didn’t have full time hours available. It illuminates something I believe deep in my core: if there’s something you wanna do, you’re gonna find the time to do it. Dear, My Novel: Are you listening? It also involved substantial risk. Chen and his wife gave him a year to turn the business into a career—a measure he explains as being able to take a salary. The story he tells is both deeply instructive and inspiring, a roadmap of sorts for what it takes to flip that side hustle into a full-time job. Ah, the dream!

Now? Mr. Chen has a new hobby. He is a runner. It started as a way to pass the time until his preferred gym re-opened, and slowly became a full-blown passion, a daily meditation of sorts. We discussed his foray into fashion, the lean years, how he got into running, the shoes he runs in, and how he incorporates his newer-found love into 3sixteen. Check out our conversation below, and please tell a friend about The Hobbyist.

I feel like all the cool stores are in SoHo. Or, they used to be.

Andrew Chen: It’s actually gotten even better since we moved in. I think when we signed the lease, it was obviously a pretty desirable neighborhood, but a lot of friends have moved into the neighborhood. When you think about New York bouncing back post-2020, this is a neighborhood that really is thriving now.

How long have you had the storefront for?

AC: We signed the lease for this one in December of 2019. We officially opened in August of 2020, so we’re coming up on five years.

What brought you into the fashion world in the first place?

AC: Oh man. So, the company is 22 years old. I had not worked in the industry or had any experience in it prior to starting the brand. So I was, I guess 24, 25 years old, something like that, and started it with a friend of mine just as a creative outlet and something to be able to work on outside of my extremely boring day job. I was really into these underground streetwear brands back in the early 2000s. E-commerce was not as well developed as it is now. You would have to find a lot of these brands in person or at very niche websites. I was really into brands that would reference art, music, and political ideology—not locked into just a logo on a t-shirt. A lot of these were started by artists and people that I admired. It was a nice peek into downtown New York, but there were also brands on the West Coast that were also doing stuff like this. We just wanted to try and add our voice to the mix and see if we could make something that people would want to buy. So that was 2003.

That’s amazing.

AC: We printed our first t-shirts in the summer of 2003.

Were you in New York at this point?

AC: I was actually in Chicago at this point. I went to Chicago for undergrad and my first job out of college had me stay in Chicago. I was there and it happened that one of the five stores in the country that were in tune with the streetwear marketplace. The shop wasn’t too far from where I went to school. The shop was called Leaders 1354 in Hyde Park. When we had our first line sheet, I brought it over the photocopied little packet and handed it to the shop owner, and he put in an order for 20, 30 t-shirts right there on the spot.

Where are you from originally?

AC: I'm from New York. I went out to Chicago for school, worked there for a couple years, and started 3sixteen while I was there. When I met my now wife, we moved back to New York. That was in 2008, 2009.

What was your day job when you first started the brand?

AC: I was in IT consulting. We would travel to different client sites and we would interview them and try to figure out where their systems were broken and how to fix it, programming it for them. None of it ever got implemented over the years of doing that job [laughs]. You would just sit down and would meet with people for months and you'd try to solve these problems. You'd present it to them, you'd build something for them. And in most of the cases, it would never go to completion. I was always struck by how much waste there was. I mean, I was getting paid. It's not like I wasn't being compensated for my time, but it was extremely unfulfilling. Maybe this was a direct outpouring of wanting to make something and have it exist and see if other people were into it.

How long was it before you turned 3sixteen into your full-time job?

AC: I quit my full-time job in 2009. My wife and I agreed that it would take some time to build it to a place where I could earn a salary off of it. I asked for a year, and it ended up being three-ish years of not making any money. I got scrappy. Obviously my wife supported us, and I tried to find other jobs on the side that could supplement our income. But I took my first paycheck right before our first son was born, in January of 2011.

That must be the best feeling in the world.

AC: The paycheck was extremely small, but it was something. I think one thing somebody told me was if you're not able to pay yourself, then it's not a real business. Obviously for many years, every dollar that was coming in was going straight back in to make some more jeans to keep our stock levels up and whatnot. But it was a real turning point. Now it does a lot more than that. We're able to employ a small team of designers, warehouse staff, retail team, and all that.

You may not be able to sum it up neatly, but how do you get from that first tiny paycheck to where you are now? What's the big milestones that got the brand from growing to some semblance of consistency?

AC: It was locking into something that people really wanted from us, or maybe building a market and putting it out there. Jeans turned everything around for this brand. We designed jeans as part of our first full collection, which was fall of 2008. That was a big milestone for the brand because until that point, we were making graphic tees, some sweatshirts, and a couple of cut and sew pieces here and there. In fall of 2008 we put out everything. We made some outerwear. We collaborated with Quoddy out in Maine to make some shoes. We released raw selvedge denim in two colors, indigo and black—both in our classic straight leg fit. Though most of the streetwear stores didn’t really stick with us because the collection was too expensive for them, we were able to grind it out and find new retailers that were into what we were doing.

The most notable of those brands was Self Edge. Self Edge came on board and started carrying the jeans in 2009. My partner Johan and I ended up helping to open up their New York and LA locations. We were there front and center. We were doing retail operations in a storefront that sold our jeans and a few other things, but mostly the jeans. That was really where the upward trajectory started to happen because we realized that we couldn't keep up with everything else. We couldn't keep developing a whole collection and spending money on it when people wanted the jeans, and we couldn't keep the jeans in stock. So, we cut the rest of the collection. We just focused on jeans for three, four years. Any money that came in would go back out, buy more fabric, pay a factory, and buy trims. It was several years of borrowing from ourselves when we needed cash flow because we couldn't get bank loans. We were trying to flip the money as quickly as we could so we could go and make some more jeans. It got to the point where we were able to start developing a collection again many years later, once we had some financial security and things were moving along

Can you look upon that period fondly now, or is it still a little bit scarring with how deep in the trenches you were?

AC: No, I definitely am thankful for it. I look back on it fondly. It was very stressful at the time, for sure. It was stressful for Johan for different reasons because he was overseeing the production. He had to deal with a lot of the day-to-day issues of making, packing, and shipping garments. I would oversee the financial side. There'd be plenty of nights where I was like, ‘I have no idea how we're going to pay this bill,’ but I think stuff like that is important. Even as we've grown, that doesn't mean that there haven't been periods of time where we've been under financial stress as well. Not so much that we can't sell anything, but maybe we can't keep up. There's demand and we can't always meet it at the level that we want to. Every once in a while, something like that is important to keep you sharp, so that you don't get too comfortable. Last year was super tight because we opened a new retail store in LA and that was an enormous upfront financial cost that we had to juggle alongside all of our regular production schedules that we had to keep up.

Were you always a fashion dude? Was that something that you gravitated towards growing up?

AC: I knew what I liked, but as a family, we didn't put a lot of emphasis on spending money on clothes. We were never in need of anything, there was always food to eat, and it was always somewhat warm in the house. But having immigrant parents, they were just concerned with me studying hard and getting good grades. I would just wear a lot of hand-me-downs and stuff.

I knew what I liked. I was always noticing what people were wearing. As I got older and had a little more agency, I started working, I would be able to go and buy things. One thing that I really was never able to have until I was an adult was cool sneakers. A lot of the sneakers that I was able to buy were things that I loved in my youth, but couldn't afford until I was working and was making my own money.

One of my first big adult purchases actually came at your store. I bought my first pair of Blackstock & Weber loafers that you guys were carrying.

AC: That’s a good adult purchase. Those are great.

Is the fashion scene competitive? I feel like it’s communal. Do I have that right?

AC: There is always some competitiveness that people don't put out there. It's probably simmering under the surface. There are a lot of brands that we came up together with. We understand what each other is going through. I met Chris from Blackstock because he walked into the shop a few months after we opened up and bought a bunch of our fleece. He bought some sweatshirts and sweatpants, and I wasn't in the shop when he bought it, but I saw his email. I'm like, ‘Oh, I got to reach out and say what's up.’ We became really good friends. Examples like that have been really nice. We also learn a lot from the heritage brands that we collaborate with. We have a really great relationship with Schott NYC. They've been around for generations now, and we have a very special working relationship with them.

You’re one of the first people I wanted to talk to for The Hobbyist because you’re a runner. I’m a big fan of your Strava game. When did you get into running?

AC: This would've been maybe three years ago at this point. I know a lot of people got into running in 2020 when gyms closed down and you couldn't really do anything. It was something that people would really take a lot of pleasure in, clearing their head and whatnot. But for me, it wasn't until a few years after that. I had been taking boxing classes for a couple of years, and the gym that I had gone to closed up. Brandon, our sales director, used to run quite a bit and he recommended some shoes to me. I was like, I just need something to get me through this three month stretch until the gym reopens. He recommended shoes to me. I was running in gym shorts that I had for 10 years. I didn't even have compression tights on or anything. I was just running in boxer briefs and chafing up all over the place.

You'll learn real quickly not to wear boxer briefs. Scarring memories.

AC: I was just like, ‘I got to buy shoes. That's all I need to do.’ Then I can be active. I hated it, but it was temporary. It was something that I could just do for a little bit and leave it behind when I could get back to my routine. I live right by Flushing Meadows, Corona Park. It was the perfect place to start. I have a big lake by me, and the lake is a two mile loop. So the first task was like, ‘Can I circle this loop without stopping?’ Then you tack on the lake loop plus circling the globe, and that's 3.3 miles. So those are my two routes that I just started running over and over again. Obviously, it stuck. I think a friend told me to sign up for a race just to have something to train for, and I signed up for the Queens 10K, which is also in that park. From there, at some point in time due to that consistency and training, I was able to move on from, ‘I really hate this.’ I discovered I could actually do something that I thought was very difficult.

It becomes more joyful, too.

AC: There are still some people that will say ‘Yeah, I still don't like it, but I do it.’ While that can be the case on any given day overall, my perspective and my outlook on it has obviously changed quite a bit to where I now love it. It's just an important part of how I think stuff through and how I am able to feel like I get a productive start to the day. It does a lot for me.

No matter how shitty the run is, the feeling when you're done is just the best.

AC: Every single time.

What was the first pair of shoes that you bought?

AC: Nike Zoom X Invincibles, the first version of them. They were crazy because I was running in 990 V5s and didn't understand why my feet hurt. Brandon was like, you got to get some running shoes. That was the first time I had worn running shoes. It was crazy! They're so cushy, so bouncy. There's obviously other reasons why my body was hurting. I wasn't stretching properly, I wasn't preparing, but that helped a ton. I was like, ‘This is actually not painful and difficult to slog through when I have the right equipment for it.’

What do you wear now? I’m a gear obsessive.

AC: Right now I've been wearing Hokas. I run in the Mach X 2. They're my first shoe that I've run in that has a nylon plate in them. Until now, I've always opted for shoes that are just high cushion, real bouncy. I'm a bigger guy, so I just try and look for things that will decrease the impact on my joints. These shoes have that bounce to them, but they've got a little plate in there that gives you a little spring, a little push forward. While nobody will ever mistake me for being fast, I feel fast in them.

A little faster every day is all that matters. If not timewise, then spiritually!

AC: I'm like year to year to year. One thing that I've been learning about running is that progress is not linear at all. I've been dealing with injuries from running. I find that to be both humbling and really helpful for me. There are so many things that you can get better at exponentially when you start. That happens for some time, but then you hit a wall. Me trying to fight through that wall has been a good experience, I would say.

Have you done lifting and stuff like that to strengthen those injured spots?

AC: I injured my ankle over a year ago. It was lingering for a long time and it wouldn't go away. I was training for the New York City half marathon last year, and I cramped up a bunch during the race. I couldn't walk. I had to stop and stretch and I had hobbled through certain parts and I was like, enough is enough. I found a trainer that my friend recommended, and he's been putting me through a lot of strength work. It took a lot of plyo to correct it, and now we’re getting it stronger to improve my running economy. We’ve had to rebuild more than just my body. It’s rebuilding my confidence, too.

I try not to share too much, but there are times where I'm bummed out. I'm like, ‘I don't feel like anything is happening here.’ He's been really helpful to walk me through it again, helping me to reframe what progress should look like. Especially at my age, you don't just do things and things get better. There is any range of results that you can have day-to-day, week to week, month, month. Consistency and showing up have been the biggest things that I've gotten out of this work.

Talk to me about the World’s Fair Run Crew. Some of the best socks in the game, I might add.

AC: I mentioned before that I signed up for the Queens 10K just as some goal to keep me on track. At the time it was so daunting. I had never run six miles before. I did it. I wasn't fast, but I finished six miles and didn't stop. I noticed a bunch of people on the course wearing WFRC and I went home and I looked it up and it turns out that they are a run crew in Flushing Queens that trains in Flushing Meadows. I never really thought to run with other people. Every day I would just wake up and do it on my own. At that point I was like, ‘If I want to go and run, I have to be able to somehow keep up. I'll never be the fastest, but I definitely don't want to be holding people back or whatever.’ Once I had finished the 10K, I was like, ‘Maybe I can actually hang.’ I showed up and met some people. This was in the dead of summer, so there were times where I really was the last person out there trying to huff and puff and keep up. But it felt good. As you get older, I guess your friend groups kind of shrink and there aren't as many places where you feel comfortable meeting people. I met some really, really great people through it.

It's kind of like a weekly check-in. I still do all the rest of my training alone. World's Fair is three community miles. Nobody's trying to do their speed work there. It's an excuse to see people and get some movement. It's been really nice. The group is full of really, really wonderful people that I would not have met otherwise.

Let’s talk about the pair of running shorts and active collection that 3sixteen made.

AC: There’s also a running pullover and some tees and a couple other things too. It all kind of coincides with our internal team interest in movement. We've had people at 3sixteen who've run in the past and still do today, but with World's Fair, once they found out that I was part of a brand that had a shop in downtown Manhattan, they were like, ‘Can we use your space to run out of just once or twice to see?’ We did that, and then we started doing this thing called Summer Series where during the summer months, we'll host a monthly run, just welcoming people into our space, helping them to see what we do, which might seem a little distant from running. Once you explain to them that, like, this brand is actually just an amalgamation of lots of things that we're into, it makes more sense.

You're going to see throughlines of music and film and all the kinds of influences that at first glance you might not notice. Running was becoming a thing that we as a whole were really enjoying. We designed a short that we felt like could be used for running, but also could be worn casually. There's no liner in that short. I've put it to the test. Last spring we went to Italy and I packed some compression shorts that I wore under them. If I wanted to go running, I would wear them with compression shorts. If we were just sightseeing, the inseam wasn't so tiny to where you feel wacky walking around in ’em. They're a quick dry nylon, so you can just wash 'em in the sink and hang them up and they're good to go. They were actually a really functional piece. That was our entry point. We just wanted to make a few things that we thought could fit our brand's design ethos and also be something that you could take to the gym and do a workout class in, or lift in, or run in. It’s definitely not a big part of our business at all, but I think it's important for us to be able to have little things here and there that cue people into what we're excited about. I think that a lot of the things that we do outside of our work inform the way that we design and run the brand.

I want people to get a piece of that personality. You may not overlap with us in a lot of things, but maybe you'll discover something new or maybe there will be a little overlap. With customers, it can be as simple as them coming into the shop and hearing something on the speakers. They're like, ‘Oh, I didn't know that you guys were into this.’ Those are all special little moments. When customers that run heard that we were hosting summer community runs out of the shop, they showed up. You have this combination of people who have no idea of what we do and people who shop with us who also run and they're meeting each other and sharing a beer afterwards. It’s been pretty cool.

Are you doing it again this summer?

AC: June, July, and August. Sometimes we'll do product demos with different brands that'll come out. Last summer, Hoka came out, Saucony came out, and you could try some of the new shoes that they had released last summer. But really it’s about getting people together on a hot summer night. We hire photographers to come and shoot, and then people come and hang out and have a drink afterwards. We also did our first un-sanctioned race last year. We did this thing called the Jorts Mile.

Sick.

AC: That was fun because it combined our interests and our business. We had people sign up to run a mile on open streets in downtown New York, and you had to run it in a hundred percent cotton jorts. A lot of chaos ensued, but people had a really good time. I felt like if we were going to put a race on, this was a race that was very true to us. It isn’t a race for hardos. This is something that you’re supposed to do and have a really good time with people.